Oh Boy...This Smell Ain't Good

[Jason2tpa]

I have a analog fuel gauge. Anyone have experience using this type of fuel sender, pictured below:





Pictured below is the type of sender I was using in the tank I just pulled. I wasn't very pleased with its accuracy (usually 1/4 off).

[Jason2tpa]

the foam you found in there was it still holding the tank good and snug?

was it the proper foam for that job?

was it originally foamed or was that during the tank repair.

did they do a bad job with the foam causing the pockets or did =the fuel cause the pockets.

I am full of questions tonight?

Yes.

No idea.

Tank repair and/or when the previous owner replaced fuel hose (because it looks new)

This type of foam I know is the kind you pour in, then it hardens. I've never poured in foam, so I don't know how difficult it is to work with once it's poured. How would one prevent air pockets from forming within the foam if one of primary components of the foam in its pre-hardened state is air. Dunno. Let's just say it could have been done much better, though the tank was secure.

Yes.

[Jason2tpa]

the foam you found in there was it still holding the tank good and snug?

was it the proper foam for that job?

was it originally foamed or was that during the tank repair.

did they do a bad job with the foam causing the pockets or did =the fuel cause the pockets.

I am full of questions tonight?

Yes.

No idea.

Tank repair and/or when the previous owner replaced fuel hose (because it looks new)

This type of foam I know is the kind you pour in, then it hardens. I've never poured in foam, so I don't know how difficult it is to work with once it's poured. How would one prevent air pockets from forming within the foam if one of primary components of the foam in its pre-hardened state is air. Dunno. Let's just say it could have been done much better, though the tank was secure.

Yes.

[99yam40]

all that weight being pounded around can do strange things to mechanical devices holding tanks in place.
the foam you found in there was it still holding the tank good and snug?
was it the proper foam for that job?
was it originally foamed or was that during the tank repair.
did they do a bad job with the foam causing the pockets or did =the fuel cause the pockets.

I am full of questions tonight?

[Jason2tpa]

A good tank, NOT leaking, foam won't hold fuel as there is none.

Yes and no. The foam won't hold fuel, if fuel isn't present. But what it will hold is water, saltwater to be exact. Even a perfectly water tight fuel tank compartment is still exposed to humidity. Which in turn becomes condensation, so on and so on.

Now this is no big deal so long as the tank is not is constant contact with moisture. Foam provides the surface contact point for this water.

Just some thoughts. Before this fuel tank mess I couldn't speak much about fuel tanks and their installation techniques. Read a lot past few days. Overwhelming consensus is foam is bad for aluminum tanks.

[TownsendsFJR1300]

No I didn't see that, but remember, the tank leaked as it was old /failed A good tank, NOT leaking, foam won't hold fuel as there is none.

I like the idea of the epoxy as posted for the Grady Whites...

The fuel tank folks probably can give you the best way to secure it W/O foam..

I have no idea how my tank is secured(60 gallons. I'll peek in the small access hole and see what I can tomorrow. Curious now...

[Jason2tpa]

Scott...you may of missed a post I made last night. See below, especially in bold.

Has anyone utilized the Pascoe method when installing fuel tank. The article about this method is here: How to Install an Aluminum Fuel Tank : Boats, Yachts - Maintenance Repair and Troubleshooting

I like the idea of the pvc strips bonded to tank in order to elevate tank from coffin bed. But what concerns me about bonding the pvc strips to the coffin bed with 5200 is having to remove the tank in the future. Most of you have likely used 5200 to bond this or that. For those who have had the fun experience of breaking the 5200 bond, I've felt your pain. It's a tough task even when you have direct access to the bond. But how do you break the bond with no access???

If you had to remove the tank you'd have no way of accessing the bottom of the tank to chisel away the 5200 bond. And since it's bond is so amazing, if you pry the tank straight up you will take off the surface of the coffin bed thats adhering to the pvc strips. Kinda concerning, right?!

What are some other methods of packing the fuel tank to the coffin? After removing all of the foam in my fuel coffin there is no way I would use that stuff. There were pockets everywhere within the foam that was holding fuel residue.

A fellow member on my classic aquasport forum recently installed a new tank. He used the above mentioned Pascoe method, except he did not 5200 the pvc strips to the coffin bed (believing like me, this will pose a problem in the future). He secured strap rings to the bottom of coffin, 3 straps over the width of tank. It's something I'm considering because there is no way i'm foaming. No doubt foam works perfectly for its function. But it's wet. I witnessed this last night when excavating it from the fuel coffin. Small cells had formed within the foam and guess what was inside these cells....fluid...fuel to be exact.

[Jason2tpa]

Scott...you may of missed a post I made last night. See below, especially in bold.

Has anyone utilized the Pascoe method when installing fuel tank. The article about this method is here: How to Install an Aluminum Fuel Tank : Boats, Yachts - Maintenance Repair and Troubleshooting

I like the idea of the pvc strips bonded to tank in order to elevate tank from coffin bed. But what concerns me about bonding the pvc strips to the coffin bed with 5200 is having to remove the tank in the future. Most of you have likely used 5200 to bond this or that. For those who have had the fun experience of breaking the 5200 bond, I've felt your pain. It's a tough task even when you have direct access to the bond. But how do you break the bond with no access???

If you had to remove the tank you'd have no way of accessing the bottom of the tank to chisel away the 5200 bond. And since it's bond is so amazing, if you pry the tank straight up you will take off the surface of the coffin bed thats adhering to the pvc strips. Kinda concerning, right?!

What are some other methods of packing the fuel tank to the coffin? After removing all of the foam in my fuel coffin there is no way I would use that stuff. There were pockets everywhere within the foam that was holding fuel residue.

A fellow member on my classic aquasport forum recently installed a new tank. He used the above mentioned Pascoe method, except he did not 5200 the pvc strips to the coffin bed (believing like me, this will pose a problem in the future). He secured strap rings to the bottom of coffin, 3 straps over the width of tank. It's something I'm considering because there is no way i'm foaming. No doubt foam works perfectly for its function. But it's wet. I witnessed this last night when excavating it from the fuel coffin. Small cells had formed within the foam and guess what was inside these cells....fluid...fuel to be exact.

[TownsendsFJR1300]

Wonder how Grady White or Regulator or other high end boats do it?

I understand it is structural but I believe it is a short term, cheap solution.

My neighbors Mako (older, very WELL built, heavy duty hull) had a foamed in tank. Over the top too.

He had some leaks, all on top, by the sender unit. We had to scrape the discolored foam from there for the repair.


Looks like they use EPOXY!!! http://www.greatgrady.com/forum/view...hp?f=3&t=15490

https://www.grainger.com/product/RUS...-Coating-3XH23

[pstephens46]

Wonder how Grady White or Regulator or other high end boats do it?

I understand it is structural but I believe it is a short term, cheap solution.

[TownsendsFJR1300]

All I know is that foam sucks. I think it is a manufacturing crutch.

Until someone tells me otherwise.....

It's a good way to keep a heavy (when full) tank from moving about especially under rough seas, hull pounding, etc.

How else really could you secure a plastic or aluminum tank to a hull?

Even if you welded tabs to the tank and screwed them to the stringers, they'd either rip loose, come loose or the tank tabs would break.

Hulls filled with foam (un-sinkables), obviously can do this as the foam displaces the water and allows the hull to float even thou NOT water tight anymore...

Now, if you want to extend the life of the exterior of an aluminum tank (and get 40 years vs 20 years), powder coat the exterior of it... That's not terribly expensive and does hold up very well...

[pstephens46]

I did, until I researched the selection of poly tanks on the market. I will need a custom tank because of the atypical tank dimensions and location of fuel/vent fittings and sender. Pictured below.



The poly tanks on the market are manufactured using a mold. So in order for me to have a poly tank I would need it custom. I couldn't tell you how much it would cost, but I'd guess 4-5x more expensive.

All I know is that foam sucks. I think it is a manufacturing crutch.

Until someone tells me otherwise.....

[TownsendsFJR1300]

For those familiar with AL welding...there are a number of marine surplus businesses in my area that sell AL fuel tanks. Let's say I find one with the dimensions I need, but fittings needed to be relocated, or more likely, the sender location would need to be relocated.

Welding a patch on the tank and relocating any of above...is this a big job for a welder? Expensive?

Moving an outlet is not a big issue. You can actually use yours if in good shape..

Cut off at the tank base (after making a template exactly where you want it, the angle, etc). Welding a patch, same thing... Price wise, depends on what they charge.

Or let them do it but obviously, the more they have to do (cut, drill, etc), the more $ it costs..

You could (with some basic metal tools) cut the new holes, fittings, etc.

As posted earlier, maybe flush/fill with water so you don't become a statistic...

*You may consider a Prop Shop if JUST welding and you do your own other metal work..
They do super fine aluminum welding fixing ALUMINUM PROPS... (that is, IF they'd even do it)



.

[Jason2tpa]

Boy, that's a big ole patch there!!!

Does the bottom and sides look as bad as the top?

Yes. And you're only seeing 1 patch in the picture. There are 3 more...1 on side and 2 on bottom.

Once I had the tank out and saw the tank had been patched 4x I decided to replace with new tank. It didn't ever occur to me to refurbish. Ticking time bomb.

[Jason2tpa]

For those familiar with AL welding...there are a number of marine surplus businesses in my area that sell AL fuel tanks. Let's say I find one with the dimensions I need, but fittings needed to be relocated, or more likely, the sender location would need to be relocated.

Welding a patch on the tank and relocating any of above...is this a big job for a welder? Expensive?