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  • F225 oil seal question

    I have a 2005 F225 that needs to have corrosion kit installed, 2 questions. Motor currently has 385 hours on it. Would you replace the oil pump? Would you replace the lower oil seal and install the speedie sleeve at this time (since it will all be apart)? No oil leak at this time, just potential preventative maintenance. Corrosion is not bad on motor, but replacing because I plan to keep a long time.

    Thanks

  • #2
    If your plan is long term and taking apart already then yes I would replace all that you posted while apart.
    No way to know if it will last but should make you feel better to know you did all you could

    Comment


    • #3
      why replace the oil pump?
      you may remove it and inspect the seal surface.
      there is not much inside that pump that fails.

      Comment


      • #4
        I also did not think actual oil pump needed replacement at this point. Mainly interested in the seal and sleeve, which I have read can be problematic. Inspect seal surface and decide based on that? Seal and sleeve I guess would be prudent at least. Trying not to create more problems than I fix..

        Comment


        • #5
          It all comes down to personal opinion. And God knows there are many of those.

          Yamaha recommends replacing the oil pump when the speedy sleeve is installed.

          One Yamaha dealer offering a kit of parts for the mid-section corrosion repair includes a new oil pump and the speedy sleeve in his kit.

          Trouble with an oil pump (any part really) is that you can never know when (or if) it is going to fail. If it fails damage can be catastrophic. With a ten year old motor, with a ten year old oil pump, is it desirable to change the oil pump simply as a preventative measure? The only one that can decide for you is you.

          Some will change the pump when the block is removed and some won't. All comes down to personal choice. I would change the pump but I would not fault someone who wants to reuse his old pump. Once you get your block removed and inspect the pump you will be in a better position to decide what to do.

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          • #6
            speedy seal

            been using the speedy seal's for over 30 yrs and love um...if your shaft sealing area dosnt have much of a grove or pitting you can pass on it...if installing the speedy install with locktite and use the correct driver,,then inspect for any warpage,mis alignment,kinking...they are hard not to mess up...polise the shaft first...oil pumps themselves don't wear out in the real world..but shafts and seals exposed to water DO.....

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            • #7
              You are right about oil pumps not wearing out in the real world but being on the bottom of the block, in close proximity to salt water (if the boat is used in the briney blue) corrosion may get to it long before it wears out. Particularly with low hours of usage. Pump needs to be visually inspected for condition.

              Just like the mid-section itself. The pump might not be wearing out with usage, it might be corroding with the passage of time.

              There once were 8 brand new C-130 airplanes that had been parked at Lockheed for over 40 years. Libya bought them from Lockheed but the US government would not let Libya take them. They only had production flight time on them. They were ruined because of corrosion.

              Comment


              • #8
                CaptSolo, mine does not look quite like that. Had the foot off and looked, its got the beginnings of some pitting, but none that bad yet. No alarms or anything, just knew this issue was looming and want to get handled now rather that at failure.

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                • #9
                  The rate of development of this particular problem seems to be more affected by calendar time than engine running time.

                  There are many cases from the northeast US - where only 50 hours use in a boating season is not unusual - with the corrosion at near-catastrophic level in as little as ~300 hours

                  Again, my rant: too bad Yamaha won't share "the big picture" that only they see

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Spray,spray,spray

                    I tell my guys (mostly saltwater) to spray down the outside with a good oil(Not WD) and a few times on the inside..U would be amazed about how long proplusion systems last without seals drying out and the big corrosion factor in the mix..simple routine,, easy to do!! Keeps them running longer,stronger and a whole lot of less problems..don't forget that trim pump and rams...A little oil goes a long ways!!!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      whoops,,spray up

                      Originally posted by bajakeith View Post
                      I tell my guys (mostly saltwater) to spray down the outside with a good oil(Not WD) and a few times on the inside..U would be amazed about how long proplusion systems last without seals drying out and the big corrosion factor in the mix..simple routine,, easy to do!! Keeps them running longer,stronger and a whole lot of less problems..don't forget that trim pump and rams...A little oil goes a long ways!!!
                      and flush with "salt away"

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by fairdeal View Post
                        The rate of development of this particular problem seems to be more affected by calendar time than engine running time.

                        There are many cases from the northeast US - where only 50 hours use in a boating season is not unusual - with the corrosion at near-catastrophic level in as little as ~300 hours

                        Again, my rant: too bad Yamaha won't share "the big picture" that only they see
                        What again is it that you want Yamaha to share with us users?

                        On a personal note, I don't think Yamaha knows exactly what is going on with early parts. Some similar dated engines, used in twins and triples, would have one engine eaten up and the other engine right along side of it be in pristine condition.

                        Rather than dwell of figuring out why some of the same parts would corrode and some of the same parts would not, I think Yamaha focused their efforts on the design of new parts that would not corrode, or which would corrode less.

                        Thinking about this issue some more, even though the exhaust stack is dry for the most part, and cannot be readily flushed clean, the inner exhaust is prone to getting saltwater on it if and when a boat is being put on, or taken off of, a trailer in saltwater. Particular in the case of a steep ramp. So, saltwater appears to be the initial cause of the problem but there is no good way to get the salt off. I think this is why fresh water users almost never ever have the exhaust problem.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by boscoe99 View Post
                          What again is it that you want Yamaha to share with us users?
                          well, for a start:

                          there was a thread recently about, was it, a water pressure sending unit?

                          that the initial version had some problem with leakage, which could potentially travel though the wiring and destroy the ECU.

                          So, if I understood correctly, Yamaha re-designed the part

                          AND issued a Service Bulletin so that engines with the defective part could be addressed during any routine service

                          It was discussed, that OF COURSE this was done, and any competent Yamaha mechanic would OF COURSE follow up on it

                          did I get that right?

                          So - has there been a Service Bulletin issued to detail how & why to inspect F200/225s for the exhaust corrosion?

                          I am not in a position to know

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Yamaha created "kits" of the various parts that are needed for a mid-section repair once it was understood that there was a somewhat widespread problem with the early F200/F225/F250 models. Prices for the piece parts, which comprised the kits, were "policy priced" to a lower than normal sell price so that all that needed to buy the parts (individually or in kit form) could benefit from reduced prices. I am guessing from a failing memory that this was in the 2006/2007 time frame.

                            My thinking is that a dealer in the middle of the USA might not be knowledgeable of this issue since corrosion to a fresh water used motor is nil. So, if someone called a fresh water dealer and asked about a corrosion issue the dealer might rightfully say he is not aware of any.

                            When there was confusion about which mid-section repair kit (there are two) applied to which engines Yamaha issued a bulletin to all dealers in June 2012 that clarified the issue for the dealers.

                            Keep in mind that Yamaha and most, if not all, outboard motor makers only share data with their dealer network folks. If a dealer does not pay attention to what the motor maker is telling him then the public can get mislead when the dealer is asked about a particular issue. If you ask the right person at a dealer about the mid-section corrosion issue he should be able to tell you all about it. If you ask the wrong person at the dealer he may look at you with a deer in the headlights look and say what are you talking about.

                            Engine makers typically only contact the end user directly when there is a recall. Even then, if a motor has been sold from the original owner to a second owner, or if the first owner's address has changed and not been updated, then some owners are not even going to be seeing recall information. This applies to USA sold models by the way. Not sure what the situation is with respect to motors that are sold outside of the US.

                            And by the way, at some point Yamaha changed the owner's manuals to suggest that the mid-section exhaust guide and exhaust manifold be inspected for corrosion at either 1000 hours of use or after five years calendar time. But given that most seem to not even open the owners manual, let alone read it, I doubt they will get the message.
                            Last edited by boscoe99; 07-28-2015, 10:21 PM.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by boscoe99 View Post
                              at some point Yamaha changed the owner's manuals to suggest that the mid-section exhaust guide and exhaust manifold be inspected for corrosion at either 1000 hours or use or after five years calendar time.
                              OK
                              point, match.

                              or, alternatively,

                              the very essence of the word "disingenuous"

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