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2014 F9.9XPB cold start issues

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  • 2014 F9.9XPB cold start issues

    Hello,
    I have a 2014 F9.9XPB with remote controls that is very hard to start in the cold. It has been back to the dealer a couple time but they only messed with the file line pump bulb. Not too confident in that dealer. The electric choke does engage when key is pushed in. After many minutes of cranking finally giving it full throttle and backing off while cranking it started but would not hold a low idle until it warmed up. In warm weather it is harder to start than I like too but not so bad. I have not spent much time with it or tried manually choking to see results. I am looking of others who may have the same experience and found a solution. I am sure it is in the fuel feed / choke.

  • #2
    What is the complete engine serial number? Are you in the USA? The Yamaha US parts catalog does not show a model F9.9XPB. That I can find any way.

    Have you tried using the manual choke pull knob to see if that makes any difference?

    I would think that opening the throttle while trying to start the motor could possibly make the situation worse. Have you tried using the manual choke knob with the throttle completely closed to see if the start situation gets better or worse?

    Are you proficient working on a carburetor, or willing to learn to work on your carburetor, yourself?

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    • #3
      2014 F9.9XPB cold start issues

      Hello, Sorry Even though I took the number off the warranty card I got the first letter wrong. Yes US purchase , Washington state, # T9.9XPB 6AVK 1162759. I am embarrassed to say I have spent very little time troubleshooting this. There is NO manual choke to work with it is all electric. the choke is activated by a electric solenoid. As far as I can see it is only activated at initial start and turns off when you release the key. As for my skill level, I have rebuilt a number carbs of many types, don't like too but I can. Whats frustrating it is has always been hard to start I probably have 250-300 hrs in this motor but only went out a couple times last winter. After the last time we took it in I had to readjust the throttle linkage and idle stop to get a proper idle when warm.

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      • #4
        its not a solinoid.
        its an electro thermal valve.

        uses heated wax pellet technology.

        Comment


        • #5
          And if you jacked with the linkage and adjustments you will need to readjust it back to specs in manual after cleaning the carbs.

          pushing the key does nothing on a prime start model.

          If a motor has an electric choke, it should have a manual one also just in case the electric part fails

          The problem I am having with looking at the parts breakdown of your carb is it does not show either a choke or electrothermal valve.
          http://www.boats.net/parts/search/Ya...TOR/parts.html

          Seems like the parts breakdown is messed up as the part numbers do not all show up also.
          Looks like that carb has a accelerator pump type of device that would inject extra fuel when you move the throttle forward,

          maybe pumping it back and forth a few times after priming the system with the bulb would help it in starting

          The XPA model shows a starter plunger and starter rod labled in the breakdown, but I have no idea what operates them and when
          Last edited by 99yam40; 11-23-2015, 09:32 AM.

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          • #6
            I stand corrected regarding the manual choke knob. I misread the Yam parts catalog. Yam likes to show illustrations for both electric start and manual start models together and this tripped me up.

            Anyhow, your motor does have a choke plate and a solenoid to activate the choke plate. See illustration below. A Primestart device is not shown.

            When you say the choke does engage I hope that you mean you have verified that the choke plate is actually closing when the solenoid is engaged. If you were basing your comment on just a clicking sound being heard then possibly the solenoid is working but the linkage might have become disconnected. In which case you would hear and think the choke was working when in fact it might not be.

            I would first try starting the motor with the throttle fully closed. Hold the key in while cranking and even after the motor has started. If that does not make it better try cracking the throttle open just a bit. Crank, start and let the motor run for a while with the key held in. Be careful not to rotate the key to the start position when the motor is running. If that does not work try again with a bit more throttle.

            Let us know what the results are. Oh, and before first cranking the motor make sure the primer ball is goodntite so that the carburetor is filled with gasoline. And if the motor still is hard to start cold I got one more possibility up my sleeve.

            Comment


            • #7
              2014 F9.9XPB cold

              Hello, In the carb illustration it does look like a throttle pump on the side of the fuel bowl (items 20-23, 31 and 30) I will check that out. Parts list does not help us any. I would not have expected this pump on a small outboard, the solenoid shows up in the diagram for “electrical 3”. Items 13-23. If I recall correctly that linkage is connected to the choke butterfly
              Hot wax eah. I will have to study that some more. Where is that unit located?

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              • #8
                Originally posted by jimbruce View Post
                Hello, In the carb illustration it does look like a throttle pump on the side of the fuel bowl (items 20-23, 31 and 30) I will check that out. Parts list does not help us any. I would not have expected this pump on a small outboard, the solenoid shows up in the diagram for “electrical 3”. Items 13-23. If I recall correctly that linkage is connected to the choke butterfly
                Hot wax eah. I will have to study that some more. Where is that unit located?
                The hot wax comment pertains to an automatic fuel enrichment device that Yamaha calls Primestart. I don't see your motor having that device installed. Makes sense since your motor has a choke plate.

                I am not familiar with your specific carburetor but if I were to guess, what you are referring to as a "throttle pump" is an accelerator pump. When the throttle is advanced very quickly air flows in quickly whereas fuel does not flow in so quickly. The accelerator pump sprays a bit of extra fuel if and when the throttle is advanced quickly. You might want to remove the air intake cover to the carburetor and then, while looking into the throat of the carburetor, quickly advance the throttle. See if you can see some gasoline being sprayed from a nozzle into the throat.

                Now if that device is an accelerator pump then what you can do is to advance the throttle handle quickly two maybe three times prior to attempting to start the cold motor. That will add a bit of extra gasoline which should help the motor to start more quickly. Give it a try and see what happens.

                Comment


                • #9
                  being some of the parts are labeled starter plunger and starter rod ,I do not know if the device is an accelerator device or not.
                  I wonder what linkage is hooked up to the starter rod

                  I wonder if Rodbolt or someone else has dealt with one of these before and knows how it all works.

                  Anyway you look at it the start problem is one thing and the need to adjust last time to get it to idle means the carb needs cleaning now
                  Last edited by 99yam40; 11-24-2015, 10:04 AM.

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                  • #10
                    I need to work on my reading skills. I over looked the part about you having to adjust the carburetor to get it to idle properly when warm.

                    Perhaps the carburetor does need to be cleaned. They have incredibly small passageways and it does not take much to change things. Just a coat of varnish inside of a small bore can alter the air/fuel mix. These carburetors come from the factory set to run so lean that almost anything can cause them to not run (or start) so well.

                    But what you might want to do before doing anything else is to remove the tamper proof plug and then turn the idle mixture screw out somewhat, to richen up the idle mixture. This might help with the start process and it might help the engine to idle a bit better.

                    To remove the plug take a small drill bit and drill motor and just barely drill through the plug. Then, take a screw and screw it into the hole you just drilled. Then, take a pair of pliers, grab the screw, and use it to pull the tamper proof plug from the carburetor. Throw it away. Then take a flat bladed screw driver and turn the idle mixture screw counter clockwise a quarter of a turn or a half of a turn. See what happens.

                    See the photo below:

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      2014 T9.9XPB cold start

                      I want to thank you all for taking an interest in this seaming minor topic. You are all so eager to assist and to be very helpful. I understand that when a technical question is asked you have to go through all the carb/start 101 stuff and that’s good for review as well. So lets me recap what I have heard here.

                      All the staring techniques listed have been tried except pumping the throttle. If I realized there was an accelerator pump on this carb that would have been the first thing I did before turning the key. Duh! The manual says nothing about this.

                      Sorry my older terminology did not help. It depends on where you learn I guess, butterfly valve = choke plate, throttle pump = accelerator pump. The first carb I rebuild was on a 1943 Hercules and the last carb was a 1990 Quadra jet for my old 5.7L OMC.

                      The links to the parts list is good too, THX. Too bad it’s not a factory service manual. 

                      Your responses indicate to me there are no known or common issues with this system so back to standard troubleshooting.

                      I am not convinced the carb is dirty yet but it’s not out of the question.

                      The linkage adjustment I spoke of has nothing to do with the choke or carb cleanliness. The throttle cable was getting stiff and would not let the linkage return to the idle stop so it had a high idle. I adjusted the stop screw to no effect then realized the linkage was not returning as it should. After I adjusted the linkage to return I had to readjust the idle stop again. (NOT the mixture) As this had little to do with starting I did not give a good explanation.

                      Thanks for the tip in the anti-tamper plug and idle mix adjust. I may try that. Maybe pull the needle screw out and give it a light air burst before actually taking the card apart.


                      This weekend I will spend some quality time with my motor after the Turkey is all gone and follow better troubleshooting technique. I just haven’t spent the time necessary to really look at it yet. I wish this motor had duplicate controls back on the motor because it is hard to be at the helm and back at the motor at the same time.


                      I will let you know how it goes. THX

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                      • #12
                        Have you tried disassembly and a good carb cleaning. ??

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Nautical View Post
                          Have you tried disassembly and a good carb cleaning. ??
                          Did you read what he wrote?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by 99yam40 View Post
                            Did you read what he wrote?
                            Yamacop: No I did not! mainly because his last statement wasn't posted when I made my comment. The order in which they are shown may not be correct.
                            Whats your problem ?? Seems you are more interested in troubleshooting folks on this forum than troubleshooting their problems.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              The weather is now cold and nasty. Might be resulting in a bit of crankiness.

                              I hate the time change as well. Hell, I need more light at the end of the day in winter not the other way around.

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