O2 Sensor in Yamaha FT60DET 2008

[Christian]

Hi All,


Is there a 02 sensor in the Yam 60hp made in 2008?


I am having a "running rich" problem with all the associated symtoms; bad mpg (300ml/km) on a 500kg RIB, black engine oil after only a few hours, sooty propeller hub exhaust, sooty plugs.


I tried a 10k ohm pot on the tps and the manifold sensor and was able to manipulate the output voltages but without a airfuel mixture gauge not easy.

Is there a place on the engine that I can install a o2 sensor??



Cheers,
Christian

[rodbolt17]

no O2 sensor on that motor.
you could probably adapt one in the ex cover.
the ecu wont support it.
why not simply fix what you have?
what is the rail pressure?

[almetelo]

That fuel consumption is at WOT?

If yes, sounds good to me... but if you notice diference on motor operation have a look on what Rodbolt recomends

Thats the fuel consumption I get cruising with my F100 crusing at 3200/3500rpm depending on load, wind, tide etc

[boscoe99]

What is your WOT RPM?

What do the spark plugs look like after a high power run of several minutes with the motor then being shut down quickly? Photos would be good to see.

But yes, check the fuel rail pressure when the motor is being run at high power. If the pressure regulator fails and there is excessive fuel pressure then more fuel will be dumped into the motor.

Oh, what is the compression of all cylinders?

Maybe me or my conversion calculator is screwed up but 300 milliliter per kilometer seems too good to be true.

[almetelo]

Maybe me or my conversion calculator is screwed up but 300 milliliter per kilometer seems too good to be true.

Acordingly my FMM crusing at 3200/3500 rpm with just me or 2 persons on board and no gear my fuel consumption is +/- 10l/h (2.64 Gal/h) and with 1L (0.264Gal) I can make 3Km's (1.86mi, 1.619nmi)
With 1/3 of a liter (333Milileters/ 11,26 fl oz) I can make 1 Km (0.621mi or 0.539nmi)

At very good conditions my fuel consumption is less than 10L/h which is rare, with my usually load (2 persons and gear or me my wife and the kid with a few light stuff fuel consumption is 12L/h (3.17Gal) Sometimes a little more, other times little less depending on load, wind, tide etc

My hull is also +/- 500kg/1102lb

When first intalled the FMM gauge used a bottle with 1L of gas to be sure of gauge accuracy and its right.

[boscoe99]

If you say that it is correct then I will certainly take your word for it. You have never mislead anyone here.

Now your wife on the other hand says that you are not to be trusted. But then I don't trust wives.

[almetelo]

LOL

You make me laugh...

Sometimes my wife ask me "that lie is true?"

or a friend that say

"ever I cheated you that you knew?"

If isn´t true is what my FMM gauge show but I can make a video

[99yam40]

A 100 and a 60 should use different amounts of fuel
Also depends on at what RPM and load
Being this is a T model there is a need for prop size, RPM , and load
But seems Rod asked the proper question for a rich condition he says he has

Wait for a feed back from him

[Christian]

Burning Rich

Thanks all for the input.


Exhaust cover? before water is injected? if so this would be great so I could could install (tap) a air/fuel ratio meter.


Will take pics of spark plugs.


I attach a data log file from the latest run. Does anyone spot anything odd? I mean in terms perhaps of manifold vacuum (negative pressure) at that rpm and throttle position.

Will check fuel pressure. It should be 32psi at that vacuum ? vs 42psi?

[almetelo]

Can´t open file with office 2013 (excel)

60 and 100 have diferent fuel consumption but all depends on throttle
At some throttle level can have similar fuel consumption

What I mean is that 300 ml/Km doesn´t seems to be a bad fuel consumption to me but of course depends on throttle lever/Rpm,s if motor is good propped etc etc

[greasyshaft]

almetelo

try going up one folder and extracting (right click) the .zip archive - you will then be able to view the file.

[Christian]

Burning Rich

Installed a bleed pipe on the high pressure rail side. Was able to drop the fuel pressure at idle down to 20 psi. No more smelly exhaust.


Cruising at 2900rpm and with the bleed (diy pressure reducer) off fuel pressure would not drop below 40 psi. Manifold negative pressure was 28 inches according to the YDS.


Shouldn't the fuel pressure be 32 psi since the pressure regulator valve be activated. The valve being the diaphragm thingy on the top of the VST connected to the intake manifold?


Next test: to try to activate the above valve with a vacuum pump.

[rodbolt17]

your FIRST step should be to understand how and why the various thingys are there.

then find out which thingy is feeding incorrect information to the ECU or which thingy is leaking.

when all the thingies are happy the motor runs very well with no mods.

[boscoe99]

Installed a bleed pipe on the high pressure rail side. Was able to drop the fuel pressure at idle down to 20 psi. No more smelly exhaust.

Cruising at 2900 rpm and with the bleed (diy pressure reducer) off fuel pressure would not drop below 40 psi. Manifold negative pressure was 28 inches according to the YDS. It is not negative pressure. Pressure is always positive. A manifold pressure of 28 psi would indicate the throttle is wide open. If you are only getting 2900 RPM at WOT then you are seriously over propped.

Shouldn't the fuel pressure be 32 psi since the pressure regulator valve be activated. The valve being the diaphragm thingy on the top of the VST connected to the intake manifold? Fuel pump pressure varies as a function of manifold pressure.

Next test: to try to activate the above valve with a vacuum pump.

See comments above.

The fuel pump output pressure specification is 41.2 psi when the key is just turned on (pump runs for about three seconds). With the motor warmed up and at idle the pressure is 32.7 psi. The regulator is plumbed to manifold pressure. As the manifold pressure rises and lowers, so too does the fuel pressure. The fuel injectors are located within the intake manifold. Before start up the manifold pressure is high. As high as it can be. Once the motor is started the manifold pressure lowers. While running, as you open the throttle the manifold pressure will rise and the fuel injection output pressure will rise. This is to keep the same pressure differential (between the injector pressure and the manifold pressure) the same at all times.

The exhaust cover is tapped for an air/fuel gauge. Item 26 in the illustration below shows the plug that is threaded into the fitting. Remove that plug and you can install an O2 sensor.

2006 and Later T60TLR Yamaha Outboard CYLINDER CRANKCASE 1 Diagram and Parts

If the O2 sensor is connected to an air/fuel meter then obviously you can see the air/fuel ratios at idle, WOT and any point in between. But, what is the purpose? Yamaha does not publish any data that indicates what the air/fuel ratios should be.

I can tell you that as a result of some tests that I did these motors run rich. Very rich. So much so that it surprised me. Yamaha USA training department talks on and on about Stoichiometric but these motors come no where close.

[boscoe99]

Almetelo, help cross check me on my math. We USAians are ignorant when it comes to metric. We are one of only two countries left in the world I believe that have not come into the 20th century and adopted SI units of measure.

Below is a Yam PB for an RIB with an F60. According to my calculations the boat at WOT is getting an economy value of 2.3 Km per liter. If the OP is consuming .3 liters per Km he would be getting roughly 3 Km per liter. Yes? If so, that is better than the PB indicates. And PB's are usually the best that a motor will ever get.

What am I missing?