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YDS 1.33 Engine is running or shifter is in F or R

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  • YDS 1.33 Engine is running or shifter is in F or R

    The problem I'm having is the F90TLR runs at fast idle but when brought down to slow idle it stalls.

    From the limited YDS data that I got:
    Engine Monitor==> TPS voltage=.973V and ISC valve opeing=60%
    Data Logger ==> TPS voltage from 1850 (1.23V) to 3300 rpm (1.76V).

    I wanted to static test the ISC valve and can't get past the "Engine is running...or in F or R" msg.
    I have tried multiple positions of N and can't seem to find the sweet spot.

    Is there anything I can do to force into N position as a work around to this msg?

    In general, I can't run any of the static or active tests b/c of this issue.

    Any ideas?

  • #2
    so its sounds like your problem is,
    the "shift position switch" is telling the ECM that the engine is in gear
    when its really not

    Comment


    • #3
      That is correct.

      So the real question might be what do I need to do the make the ECM think that it's in neutral?

      Were is the sensor that the ECM reads to determine if is in N?

      Is the "shift position switch" located at the motor head or and the shift control?

      Comment


      • #4
        should be at the motor

        Comment


        • #5
          Likely part #45: https://www.boats.net/catalog/yamaha...r-0411/control
          Scott
          1997 Angler 204, Center Console powered by a 2006 Yamaha F150

          Comment


          • #6
            Originally posted by TownsendsFJR1300 View Post
            May just need to be tightened down.

            Comment


            • #7
              fix your TPS value at idle and the issue will go away.
              the ECU sees the added TPS voltage and assumes it is either in gear or running.
              ECU's are not very bright.
              they are simple truth tables.

              Comment


              • #8
                RodBolt17 says..."fix your TPS value at idle and the issue will go away."

                I can't get the motor to run at idle.

                Using the YDS1.33 I get the following: Engine Monitor==> TPS voltage=.973V

                Is there an initial setting (threshold setting) that has to be done?

                Any ideas?
                ================================================== =============
                I edited this after the post.
                The TPS is a 3-pin device. The center pin is grd, 1 of the pins is tied to 5v and the other is what is variable.
                From my investigation the idle voltage s/b between .8-1.2v, according to the SM.
                Last edited by jackmanjls; 12-02-2018, 10:53 PM.

                Comment


                • #9
                  I think it was around .7, but I am not an expert like Rod

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    I verified the TPS voltage was at .97v, the SM spec is .8-1.2v. I'm in spec.

                    The shift position switch (part#45 on the intake 1 diagram for F90TLR). This is a micro switch. I verified with a meter
                    that when in the neutral position the switch was closed and at all other times was open.

                    I then connected the YDS1.33, turned the key to the on position and still couldn't get past the msg: "Engine is running...or in F or R".

                    I'm starting to wonder if this isn't an inherent problem with the YDS.
                    I did uninstall then reinstalled but still got the same results...."Engine is running...or in F or R".

                    Any ideas on what else I could do to get past the msg in the YDS?
                    Last edited by jackmanjls; 12-03-2018, 03:16 PM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      did you look to see what the micro switch as reading at that time on the YDS
                      just because you read it on a meter does not mean it is what the ECU is seeing.
                      and I do not understand that wide of range for the TPS on a non running motor unless the throttle is not closing as it should

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        99yam40...the TPS voltage read a solid .97v, the spec from the SM gave a range of .8-1.2v. I would say my reading is solid and in spec.

                        I will check the input at the ECU.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          if the shift position switch has failed you will get a code 28.
                          or you can simply use YDS to observe the switch going from on to off as you toggle the shift slide.
                          most position switchs have a resistor in them. that way if the ECU ever see's a dead short or a wide open it will set code 28.
                          every time for the past 18 years or so I have seen that engine running or in gear message it has been a TPS issue.
                          if the ECU see's more than about 3* of throttle angle that is what gets displayed.

                          remember that ECU is a rather dumb black box. it is simply a truth table.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Rodbolt...I included the YDS output that I took after I read your reply.

                            I did get a code 18 TPS at 1083.8 hrs but I also verified, using the YDS, that the switch went from on to off as I toggled the shift slide.

                            Some observations:
                            1. Diagnosis ==> TPS is normal
                            2. Diagnosis Record ==> TPS code 18 occurred at 1083.8hrs
                            3. Monitor Item ==> notice the TPS voltage is .934v within the SM spec, that is, .8 - 1.2v
                            4. Data Logger[Data comparison graph]:TPS voltage(0.5-4.5v)[V] ==> all the values seem to be in range

                            Of the 4 items above all but #2 is reasonable.

                            Is this enough evidence to justify replacement of the TPS?
                            If so, why?


                            ================================================== ================================================== ======================
                            Save date December 08 2018
                            ECM No.: 6D88591A10
                            Diagnosis
                            Code Item Result Condition
                            13 Pulser coil Normal
                            15 Water temp sensor Normal
                            17 Knock sensor Normal
                            18 Throttle position sensor Normal
                            19 Battery voltage Normal
                            23 Intake temp sensor Normal
                            28 Shift position switch Normal
                            29 Intake press sensor Normal
                            37 Intake air passage Normal
                            44 Engine stop lanyard switch Off
                            49 Over cooling Normal
                            Diagnosis Record
                            Total hours of operation 1084
                            Code Item Occurred
                            28 Shift position switch 756.2
                            29 Intake press sensor 756.2
                            15 Water temp sensor 1039.8
                            13 Pulser coil 1080.8
                            18 Throttle position sensor 1083.8
                            Engine Monitor
                            Monitor Item Result Unit
                            Engine speed 0 r/min
                            Intake pressure 110.52 kPa
                            Intake pressure 27.99 inHg
                            Atmospheric pressure 1065.3 hPa
                            Atmospheric pressure 31.5 inHg
                            Ignition timing - deg
                            Battery voltage (12-16) 11.8 V
                            TPS voltage (0.5-4.5) 0.934 V
                            Throttle valve opening (0-90) 5.8 deg
                            ISC valve opening 60 %
                            Fuel injection duration 0 ms
                            Water temperature (below 90) 40.5 C
                            Water temperature (below 194) 90.4 F
                            Intake temperature (below 70) 40.5 C
                            Intake temperature (below 158) 90.4 F
                            Engine stop lanyard switch OFF
                            Shift position switch ON
                            Oil press switch ON
                            Dual engine system switch OFF
                            Data Logger[Engine operating hours according to engine speed]
                            Engine speed Time[h]
                            - 1000 r/min 283.6
                            1000 - 2000 r/min 381.4
                            2000 - 3000 r/min 21.1
                            3000 - 4000 r/min 146.6
                            4000 - 5000 r/min 168.9
                            5000 - 6000 r/min 82.8
                            6000 - 7000 r/min 0
                            Engine hours 1084
                            Data Logger[Data comparison graph]
                            Engine speed[r/min] Battery voltage (12-16)[V] TPS voltage (0.5-4.5)[V] Water temperature (below 90)[C] Intake pressure[kPa] Oil press switch[0:OFF 1:ON]
                            4050 12.74 1.8 62.5 68.1 0
                            5050 12.3 2.89 58.6 94.3 0
                            4000 12.74 1.82 63.3 70.6 0
                            3850 12.38 1.78 63.3 70.1 0
                            3900 12.67 1.78 64.2 70.1 0
                            3950 12.3 1.8 64.2 71.1 0
                            3950 12.08 1.8 64.2 70.6 0
                            3950 12.6 1.8 63.3 70.1 0
                            3500 12.96 1.62 64.2 64.7 0
                            1000 12.96 1.04 61.7 37.5 0
                            950 12.52 1.04 61.7 35.5 0
                            950 13.04 1.04 60.8 35 0
                            700 12.82 0.98 60.8 35 0
                            Last edited by jackmanjls; 12-09-2018, 10:25 AM.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              ok
                              I will attempt ONE more time.
                              you either have a sensor 5Vref issue or a sensor ground issue.
                              remember that black box is dumb as a box O rocks.
                              for starters lets look at intake pressure vs barometric pressure on a non running engine.
                              what would you expect?
                              now lets go back to what I said about throttle angle?
                              now lets look at that TPS code set .2hr ago.
                              now that you have a record clear all the codes and see if any come back.
                              once that code is set it wont update.

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